From tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com Tue Oct 24 02:41:53 1995
	Archive-name: magick/faq
	Version: 9510
	Posting-Frequency: monthly or by inquiry

	================================================================

		The Alt.Magick FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
    		by tyaginator (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com)

	================================================================

     				TABLE OF CONTENTS

	10 NEWSGROUP

	11 Why do you spell magick with a K? etc.
	12 Shouldn't there be limits to what people can post here?

   	20 CONTENT

   	21 What is magic(k)?
   	22 Is magick real, how does it work, what influences it? etc.
   	23 Is magick black/white?  Should we do black magick?
   	24 Is magick compatible with modern Science?
   	25 How are magick and religion/mysticism related or different? etc.

   	30 SPELL REQUESTS

   	31 Love/Lust
   	32 Summoning Demons/Cursing/Death
	33 Role Playing Game Spells

   	40 STUDIES

   	41 How should I start learning about magick? teachers?
	42 What are some books for a beginner?
   	43 Where is online information about magick to be found? etc.


   	50 REFERENCES AND REFERRALS

	51 General Occult
	52 Card Game Magic ("the Gathering"/Obsession)

	================================================================

10 NEWSGROUP

	This section pertains to the most commonly asked questions about
	the newsgroup itself; specifically the newsgroup's name and its
	customs.

11 Why do you spell magick with a K?

	Alt.magick was created with a 'k' to avoid confusion with
	stage magic. @01 [@##'s are footnotes; see the end of this file.]
	'Magick' is popularly associated with Aleister Crowley, yet the
	spelling precedes him by hundreds of years. @02

	Many people presume a difference between conjuring tricks and
	occult spells; between magic and magick.  There may be grounds
	for comparing them metaphorically to chemistry and alchemy.
	Sr. Virakam and others maintain that it separated Crowley from
	his competitors (and thus served as a marketing or elitist
	scheme). @03

	Symonds and Grant contend that the 'k' is a conceit of Crowley's
	and that it is related to potentially dangerous ("demonic and
	chaotic") energies, as well as life-oriented symbols such as
	'khu' and 'kteis', for which they say it stands, "the complement
	to the wand (or phallus) which is used by the Magician in
	certain aspects of the Great Work." @04

12 Shouldn't there be limits to what people can post here?

	There has been some discussion of moderation through the years,
	and alt.magick.moderated was formed by a few of the interested.
	There are many subgroups of alt.magick to which specific types
	of discussion should be taken if you wish to cooperate with
	newsgroup regulars.  Here is a list of the discussion-oriented
	subgroups to get you started:

			alt.magick.ethics (philosophia:ethics)
			alt.magick.order  (politicos)
			alt.magick.sex    (eros/tantra)
			alt.magick.tyagi  (synthesia)

	There is a comprehensive list of posting suggestions in the
	document called 'Alt.Magick RULES'.  These are quotes from
	Usenet authorities about posting content:

		ftp://ftp.portal.com/pub/ss/Web/amgkfaq/ruleref

	With regard to limiting the *substance* or *topic*, some
	copyrighted files have been under intense heat from occult
	organizations to keep them from being posted to the newsgroup.
	There is often a great outcry anytime someone posts a ritual
	or suggestion which conflicts with the morality or maturity
	of participants, yet as alt.magick is not moderated, noise-
	levels and savvy folks who know how to cancel posted messages
	will be able to keep a single post from being seen, discussion
	of it carrying over into one of the sub-forums at most.

	In short, there are no technical limitations, but there are
	some factions (participants, occult groups) who have a very
	sincere interest in affecting what is posted.
	================================================================

20 CONTENT

    There are a few questions about magic(k) which arise
    consistently.  These concern an analysis of magick, its
    workings and principles and relationship to morality,
    science and religion.

21 What is magic(k)?

	Magick has been defined by many people in many different
	ways.  One infamous mage defined it as "the Science and Art
	of causing Change to occur in comformity with Will." @06

	Some see magick as a kind of energy which pervades the cosmos.
	Others see it as a psychic tool by which one may influence the
	material world using symbols and ritual.  Many see it as a
	means of coming to unite with the divine, and some consider
	it to be the exercise of will or Will.

	Whatever the word means, 'magick' is the subject, generally,
	of the newsgroup, and will likely be given many differing and
	contradictory meanings during discussions there.

22 Is magick real, how does it work, what influences it? etc.

	Many have suggested the differentiation of magical 'currents'
	or 'energies' based on style and/or intent.  Some posit the
	notion of principles, a la scientific structure, 'laws of
	magick' and whatnot.  Others approach it more subjectively,
	considering all knowledge about the elements of magick to be
	personal and therefore particular only to the individual
	condition, variable of form.

	All of these are popular responses to this question, though
	more inventive theories would be welcomed.  Conventional
	approaches may be cross-posted to sci.philosophy.meta.

23 Is magick black/white?  Should we do black magick?

        For discussion about the ethics of magick,
        see alt.magick.ethics.

24 Is magick compatible with modern Science?

	An oft-asked question, particularly with reference to
	Heisenberg and Chaos theories.  Hang around a little before
	getting into one of these discussions.  They can take quite a
	while to untangle.

25 How are magick and religion/mysticism related or different? etc.

	There have been a number of different discussions on these
	subjects.  The hypotheses which I can remember are the
	magick/individual:religion/group model and the idea that
	religion is the degeneration of magick.  Some do not seem to
	discern between magick and mysticism at all, and many have
	never considered the subject, being unexposed to the latter.

	Thelemites might equate magick with will and mysticism with
	love, and the association has been made between mysticism and
	theurgy, magick and thaumaturgy.  For more on mysticism, see
	the Mysticism section of the _Mage's Guide to the Internet_
	(MaGI (WWW)):

		http://www.portal.com/~tyagi/magi.html

	================================================================

30 SPELL REQUESTS

	Spells may be obtained from several offline sources, the folk
	and ceremonial varieties maintained at times with diligent care.
	The spells contained within the following sites may be dangerous
	to your health.

31 Love/Lust

        I collected a file of spell responses in alt.magick.*
        over a period of months and placed them in a REF file at:
        ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Web/amgkfaq/fukspls

        Other contributions would be welcomed (preferably linked,
        HTML documents).

32 Summoning/Cursing/Death

        Demon-summoning, curse- and death-oriented spells were
        collected from alt.magick.* over the last few years and
        these have been placed in a REF file (again, additional
        contributions welcome):

        ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Web/amgkfaq/owspls

33 Role Playing Game Spells

        If you are looking for role-playing game magic, you can find
        it in the Great Net Spellbook. @05

	================================================================

40 STUDIES

	How to learn about magick and what ought be considered the
	best sources are frequently discussed topics in the newsgroup.
	Occasionally someone will compile a REF file of newsgroup posts
	for a common topic.   Make a collection and assist in the
	project yourself:

		ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Web/amgkfaq/

		http://www.portal.com/~tyagi/amgkfaq/REFref.html

41 How should I start learning about magick? teachers? etc.

	As CHenningsson (ceci@lysator.liu.se) writes:

		"Books are one answer. There are actually books which
		 try to take you from your first tentative attempts
	 	 at relaxation into holding a ritual....

		"Other than that....  Just do it!  If you like to, you
		 can see this as one of the very first exercises in Will;
		 you Will yourself into making a ritual."

	Some recommend the use of particular mechanisms or tools, such
	as tarot, a magical diary, meditation or dreamwork.   Some
	recommend particular books or teachers, others place more
	emphasis on the aptitude and imagination of the student.

	robin (robin@winternet.com) provides marvellous advice:

		"Resist the temptation to believe what anyone else
		 tells you.  Try to invent ways to find out things
		 for yourself.  Remain skeptical.

		"Look for ways in which you have may have been
		 doing magick without realizing it.  Think about
		 what it might mean if you could use it with
		 intention, and how you might go about that."

	MKampe (markk@cypress.West.Sun.COM) offers:

		"if you have clear notions of what magick is all
		 about, it might be better for you to pursue your
		 inner course and avoid outside contamination
		 [from teachers/books/etc.]."

	I wrote an essay about learning magick online, which you
	may enjoy browsing. @07

	Teachers, masters, adepts, etc. are recurrently discussed
	in many newsgroups, and magical organizations may wrangle
	out their political issues in alt.magick.order.

	I would echo Lilith Darkchilde (lilith@slip-1.slip.net):

		"Take heed of those who say that they can teach
		 you all about what is magickal.  Especially if
		 you must join their "coven" or group to do so....

		"I hold the key to my own self knowing."

42 What are some books for a beginner?

	There's a booklist available at:

	ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Web/amgkfaq/bookref

43 Where is online information about magick to be found? etc.

	There is quite a bit of information available.  Provided
	below, please find reference to many good starting places.

				WWW

	Alt.magick REFs (WWW)
	http://www.portal.com/~tyagi/amgkfaq/REFref.html

	Mage's Guide to the Internet (MaGI) (WWW)
	http://www.portal.com/~tyagi/magi.html

				FTP

	Alt.magick REFs (FTP)
	ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/Web/amgkfaq/

	Funet FTP Site
	ftp://ftp.funet.fi/pub/doc/occult/

	Lysator FTP Site
	ftp://ftp.lysator.liu.se/pub/magick/

	Mage's Guide to the Internet (MaGI 2.0) (ASCII)
	ftp://ftp.portal.com/pub/ss/OMNet/magi

	Mage's Guide to the Internet (MaGI 1.0) (ASCII)
	ftp://ftp.portal.com/pub/ss/OMNet/magi.old

	OMNet FTP Directory
	ftp://ftp.portal.com/pub/ss/OMNet/

				TEL

	Divination Web
	telnet://densan.math.uconn.edu:9393

				USE

	news:alt.magick
	news:alt.magick.sex
	news:alt.magick.tyagi

				EML

	FiatLVX
	mailto:fiatlvx-owner@cmns.think.com
	text: "subscribe fiatlvx (email address) (real name)"

	OMiNous
	mailto:omnet-l@nosferatu.cas.usf.edu
	text: "subscribe omnet-l (first name) (last name)"

	Thelema93-L
	mailto:listserv@nosferatu.cas.usf.edu
	text: "subscribe thelema93-l (first name) (last name)"

	================================================================

50 REFERENCES AND REFERRALS

	After consulting the various resources listed in this FAQ
	and lurking in the newsgroup for a few weeks, feel free to
	bring up any relevant subjects there.

51 General Occult

	See the MaGI (listed above) for much occult-related
	information.  Usenet newsgroups which you should check out
	before being completely sure that alt.magick is the best
	place to post regarding any subject are:

        (occult-related)

        news:alt.astrology
        news:alt.chinese.fengshui
        news:alt.divination
        news:alt.magick.chaos
        news:alt.tarot

        (neopaganism/shamanism/witchcraft)

        news:alt.pagan
        news:alt.religion.asatru
        news:alt.religion.wicca
        news:alt.religion.shamanism
        news:alt.shamanism
        news:alt.techno-shamanism
        news:soc.religion.shamanism

        (darkness and power)

        news:alt.necronomicon
        news:alt.satanism

        (eastern things)

        news:alt.astrology.asian
        news:alt.philosophy.taoism
        news:alt.yoga
    	news:soc.religion.eastern

        (psychology and parapsychology)

        news:alt.consciousness
        news:alt.paranet
        news:alt.paranormal

52 Card Game Magic ("the Gathering"/Obsession)

        There are many newsgroups in the rec.games.trading-cards.*
        hierarchy from which to choose.

	================================================================

				FOOTNOTES

	@01  -	alt.magic (Stage Magic)

	@02  -  Due to his many publications and the orders he crafted,
		Aleister Crowley is revered by many and despised by as
		many more, and his magical treatise (_Book Four_,
		recently reissued assembled by the OTO) may likely
		prove his most popular text.

	@03  - 	Aleister Crowley (if Soror Virakam may be relied upon)
		is said to have adopted "the old spelling of MAGICK...
		in order to distinguish the Science of the Magi from
		all its counterfeits."
		(_Magick_, eds. Symonds/Grant, p. 45 note).

	@04  - 	_Magick_, p. xvi.

	@05  - 	ftp://ftp.win.tue.nl/pub/games/spells/html/gnsb.html

	@06  - 	_Magick_, p. 131.

	@07  -  ftp://ftp.hollyfeld.org/pub/Esoteric/FAQs/REF.lrnonln.9505

	================================================================

	Those that assisted in reviewing the FAQ whose ideas I utilized:

		(Peggy Brown) oispeggy@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
		(Ashton) ashton@netcom.com
		(peter kim) kim@newton.apple.com
		(Dshoem) dshoem@aol.com

	If you have suggestions for changes or additions to document,
	send them to the Editor (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com).

	================================================================

	This document is Copyright (c) 1995, tyagi nagasiva.

	All rights reserved.  Permission to distribute the collection
	is hereby granted providing that distribution is electronic,
	no money is involved, reasonable attempts are made to use the
	latest version and all credits and this copyright notice are
	maintained.

	Other requests for distribution should be directed to the
	Editor or to the individual authors of the quoted materials.

	tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (tyaginator)
	Editor, alt.magick FAQ (WWW/ASCII)